We use cookies to show content based on your preferences. If you continue to browse you accept their use and installation. More information. >

FMF - Friends of Minerals Forum, discussion and message board
The place to share your mineralogical experiences

FMF English Forum is moderated by John S. White and Peter Megaw
 

Spanish message board






Newest topics and users posts
24 May-23:49:50 Re: new mexico collecting - (27) (Philip Simmons)
24 May-22:56:37 Re: new mexico collecting - (27) (Philip Simmons)
24 May-16:09:47 Re: new mexico collecting - (27) (Chris Rayburn)
24 May-15:16:23 Re: new mexico collecting - (27) (Philip Simmons)
24 May-11:08:58 Re: simone citon mineral collection (J. G. Alcolea)
24 May-06:25:09 Re: new mexico collecting - (27) (Chris Rayburn)
24 May-03:12:51 The mizunaka collection - rhodochrosite (Am Mizunaka)
24 May-00:54:17 Re: collection of heimo hellwig (Heimo Hellwig)
23 May-22:35:53 Re: new mexico collecting - (27) (Philip Simmons)
23 May-16:52:55 Re: please help identify (Kevin Schofield)
23 May-16:42:22 Re: please help identify (Southernappalachian)
23 May-16:02:44 Re: please help identify (Kevin Schofield)
23 May-15:26:40 Please help identify (Southernappalachian)
23 May-14:41:14 Re: the mizunaka collection - quartz (Am Mizunaka)
23 May-10:24:44 Re: collection of dontgogreen (Dontgogreen)
23 May-03:52:50 Re: the mizunaka collection - quartz (Pierre Joubert)
23 May-00:54:59 Re: please identify - rock with white inclusions (Foreman)
22 May-19:38:51 The mizunaka collection - quartz (Am Mizunaka)
22 May-19:09:44 Re: please identify (Peter Megaw)
22 May-05:24:34 Re: collection of heimo hellwig (Heimo Hellwig)
21 May-23:04:25 Re: franjungle collection (Franjungle)
21 May-21:05:00 The mizunaka collection - rhodochrosite (Am Mizunaka)
20 May-21:35:31 The mizunaka collection - quartz (Am Mizunaka)
20 May-21:14:36 Re: please identify (Peter Lemkin)
20 May-20:23:31 Re: please identify (Dale Hallmark)

For lists of newest topics and postings click here


RSS RSS

View unanswered posts

Why and how to register

Index Index
 FAQFAQ RegisterRegister  Log inLog in
 {Forgotten your password?}Forgotten your password?  

Like
42807


The time now is May 25, 2018 11:34

Search for a textSearch for a text   

A general guide for using the Forum with some rules and tips
Meterorite or am I crazy
  
  Index -> FOR BEGINNERS: What is it? Where is it from?
Like
5


View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message

jim hill




Joined: 03 Sep 2017
Posts: 24
Location: Bessemer, PA

View user's profile

Send private message

PostPosted: May 09, 2018 20:55    Post subject: Meterorite or am I crazy  

found in hollow that i found fossilized coral


DSCN0303.JPG
 Description:
 Viewed:  696 Time(s)

DSCN0303.JPG



DSCN0024 (1).JPG
 Description:
 Viewed:  690 Time(s)

DSCN0024 (1).JPG


Back to top
This topic is locked: you cannot edit posts or make replies. Reply with quote
Like
   

Peter Lemkin




Joined: 18 Nov 2016
Posts: 114
Location: Prague

View user's profile

Send private message

PostPosted: May 09, 2018 22:15    Post subject: Re: meterorite or am i crazy  

Those are two different stones. Neither looks anything like a meteorite. You give nothing about weight, specific gravity, size, where found, hardness and the photos are not very clear - but clear enough to see the top one looks like conglomerate and the lower one much too angular to be a meteorite, whatever it is made of.
Back to top
This topic is locked: you cannot edit posts or make replies. Reply with quote
Like
   

Jordi Fabre
Overall coordinator of the Forum



Joined: 07 Aug 2006
Posts: 4070
Location: Barcelona


Access to the FMF Gallery title=

View user's profile

Send private message

PostPosted: May 10, 2018 01:58    Post subject: Re: Meterorite or am I crazy  

Jim

Sorry but you need to give us more information before we can help you. Please read Asking: "What is this? / Where is it from?" and provide us with some basic information about the specimen. We want to help those who are truly curious, but people must demonstrate their curiosity by providing us with key information before we will help them. Sorry to be so strict but we have received too many queries from people asking about material that just doesn’t interest us.
Back to top
This topic is locked: you cannot edit posts or make replies. Reply with quote
Like
   

SteveB




Joined: 12 Oct 2015
Posts: 45
Location: Canberra

View user's profile

Send private message

PostPosted: May 10, 2018 02:00    Post subject: Re: meterorite or am i crazy  

Peter Lemkin wrote:
Those are two different stones. Neither looks anything like a meteorite. You give nothing about weight, specific gravity, size, where found, hardness and the photos are not very clear - but clear enough to see the top one looks like conglomerate and the lower one much too angular to be a meteorite, whatever it is made of.


I agree, some form of conglomerate and a rock. Not even a tiny chance either resembles a meteorite, very terrestrial and mundane.
Back to top
This topic is locked: you cannot edit posts or make replies. Reply with quote
Like
   

Kevin Schofield




Joined: 05 Jan 2018
Posts: 30
Location: Houston TX

View user's profile

Send private message

PostPosted: May 10, 2018 08:08    Post subject: Re: Meterorite or am I crazy  

Jim,

on the meteorite front, definitely crazy :-)

Having said that, and not withstanding the pleas of my mineralogically-inclined colleagues on the forum here, to the geologist, these two rocks are relatively easily-identified from your (OK) pictrues:

The first one is (as others have said) a conglomerate. Geologically-speaking it's quite texturally mature (rounded to well-rounded pebble-sized clasts) with a sandstone matrix. Going out on a limb given that all you have provided is a photograph, it looks to be oligomict (dominated by one type of clast), and going even further out, those clasts look to be limestone.

The second one is a bioclastic limestone...the visible bioclasts in this case being shells (white, arcuate "fingernail parings" and fragments) and dissolved shell fragments (all of those elongate, curving holes in the rock).

Given that your bedrock in the area is Pennsylvanian (upper division of the Carboniferous), a limestone like this is not that much of a surprise. The conglomerate might also be Pennsylvanian, or, given the amount of glacial cover in the area, might be of glacial origin.

This article:
http://fcopg.org/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/70th2005.pdf
(link normalized by FMF)
has some quite good local geological information for the Bessemer area that you might find interesting.

_________________
Veni, Vidi, Emi
Back to top
This topic is locked: you cannot edit posts or make replies. Reply with quote
Like
2
   

jim hill




Joined: 03 Sep 2017
Posts: 24
Location: Bessemer, PA

View user's profile

Send private message

PostPosted: May 12, 2018 01:12    Post subject: Re: meterorite or am i crazy  

Peter Lemkin wrote:
Those are two different stones. Neither looks anything like a meteorite. You give nothing about weight, specific gravity, size, where found, hardness and the photos are not very clear - but clear enough to see the top one looks like conglomerate and the lower one much too angular to be a meteorite, whatever it is made of.


my mistake, the second pic is a impact stone from another debri field , the other i did not want to cut, and i am not equipped for a piece that sice . the one i meant to post has a s. g. of 2.94



DSCN0367.JPG
 Description:
 Viewed:  391 Time(s)

DSCN0367.JPG


Back to top
This topic is locked: you cannot edit posts or make replies. Reply with quote
Like
   

jim hill




Joined: 03 Sep 2017
Posts: 24
Location: Bessemer, PA

View user's profile

Send private message

PostPosted: May 12, 2018 01:17    Post subject: Re: meterorite or am i crazy  

jim hill wrote:
Peter Lemkin wrote:
Those are two different stones. Neither looks anything like a meteorite. You give nothing about weight, specific gravity, size, where found, hardness and the photos are not very clear - but clear enough to see the top one looks like conglomerate and the lower one much too angular to be a meteorite, whatever it is made of.


my mistake, the second pic is a impact stone from another debri field , the other i did not want to cut, and i am not equipped for a piece that sice . the one i meant to post has a s. g. of 2.94,



DSCN0371.JPG
 Description:
 Viewed:  390 Time(s)

DSCN0371.JPG



DSCN0368.JPG
 Description:
 Viewed:  390 Time(s)

DSCN0368.JPG



DSCN0369.JPG
 Description:
 Viewed:  390 Time(s)

DSCN0369.JPG


Back to top
This topic is locked: you cannot edit posts or make replies. Reply with quote
Like
   

Peter Lemkin




Joined: 18 Nov 2016
Posts: 114
Location: Prague

View user's profile

Send private message

PostPosted: May 12, 2018 01:35    Post subject: Re: Meterorite or am I crazy  

Nothing yet in the 'new' photos looks like a meteorite. I suggest you look at websites with photos of different types of meteorites [there are many quite different types]. No idea what you mean by an impact stone - but matters not on this subject. You see meteorites everywhere. I and others have seen none here. Sorry. While your photos are sufficient to rule out their being meteorites, if you care to have any help in what they are, size, weight, magnetic or not, specific gravity test, hardness test, streak, where found and other information you can find to help newbees post their queries here would help. Meteorites are rare! The metallic ones sometimes show 'rusting' from exposure, and many of all types show what is called fusion crusts. Most have ablation areas and show aerodynamic features - but not all. Usually, but not always one can find if in your area others have found meteorites, as they often [not always] land in groups from the break-up in the atmosphere of a larger body into several smaller ones. Everyone wants to find one. Few do. Like diamonds and gold they are rare, but like diamonds and gold they have certain specific characteristics - some are rather obvious, a few take sophisticated tests. Good luck meteorite hunting. I own a few and had to buy them at shows. I have never been lucky enough to find one in the field and I spend a lot of time in the field. You show five stones you hope are meteorites - all very different in how they look. I assure you there have been no blue meteorites found yet...but other features of that stone exclude it from being a meteorite. For sure you are 'meteorite crazy' and determined to have us find one in a variety of stones. Again, there are good internet sites or books on meteorites with photos of the many types. I suggest them to you. One of many is called 'Field Guide to Meteors and Meteorites' by Norton and Chitwood.
Back to top
This topic is locked: you cannot edit posts or make replies. Reply with quote
Like
   

kakov




Joined: 24 Jul 2013
Posts: 39
Location: Madrid


Access to the FMF Gallery title=

View user's profile

Send private message

PostPosted: May 12, 2018 05:25    Post subject: Meterorites should be taboo, also in English in FMF  

Dear FMFers,
I think time has come to introduce the same rule as in Spanish FMF: Meteorites are taboo. That is: any „is this meteorite?” question should be simply deleted. (of course explaining this in advance in the rules of the forum)
Believe me, it hurts to suggest this. I am more and more interested in meteorites myself. Nevertheless, these meteorite identity discussions are simply SO tedious, and take away our resources (time, attention etc.) form other truly interesting strings.
The forum “Club Space Rock” has a already an “is this a meteorite” string, we should send all these questions there.
Back to top
This topic is locked: you cannot edit posts or make replies. Reply with quote
Like
   

Bob Harman




Joined: 06 Nov 2015
Posts: 326
Location: Indiana


Access to the FMF Gallery title=

View user's profile

Send private message

PostPosted: May 12, 2018 06:07    Post subject: Re: Meterorite or am I crazy  

I agree with the recent replies of the others. Over several years Mindat had some inquiries asking about meteorites and none.....not one!......was felt to be a meteorite. The consensus was something like "we cannot help you from a photo so take your example to museum or university for an in person identification". Now, no meteorite identification on Mindat.

At the same time, I did a bit of research on meteorites pro-ported to be found in the state of Indiana. I went to the Indiana Geological Survey discussions on meteorites. Here are a few of their statistics. Between 1856 and 1991, there was 13 confirmed meteorite findings in the state. There have been a few found since and there probably are a number of unreported examples, but the IGS knows of 13 genuine finds in about 130 years . This is 1 meteorite find about every 10 years.
Also, in 100 consecutive cases, rocks brought to the IGS for meteorite identification were found to NOT be meteorites......not 1 true find in the 100 being id-ed.

Looking again at the first IGS statistic. There are about 10 - 15 people struck by lightning each year in the state of Indiana. IT SEEMS YOU ARE MORE LIKELY TO BE STRUCK BY LIGHTNING WHILE HUNTING METEORITES THAN TO ACTUALLY FIND A METEORITE !!
I also suggest eliminating photo identification of rocks thought to be meteorites; they almost certainly will all be "meteorwrongs" BOB
Back to top
This topic is locked: you cannot edit posts or make replies. Reply with quote
Like
1
   

Peter Lemkin




Joined: 18 Nov 2016
Posts: 114
Location: Prague

View user's profile

Send private message

PostPosted: May 12, 2018 07:57    Post subject: Re: Meterorite or am I crazy  

There is a rock shop [not high end ;-), but has some interesting local stuff] in Moab, UT with a HUGE pile of thousands of stones outside - all meteorwrongs brought in for hopeful identification. Some were iron concretions or just plain iron, others were 'just rocks' of all varieties, usually slightly heavier or slightly less common in appearance (to a novice) than your 'ordinary stone' - but some not even that. Hope springs eternal and apparently with little research. With the internet it is not hard to find photos of all kinds of meteorites and information about some common characteristics and how rare they are. The few places they are not quite as rare as other places tend to be very very very remote, such as the Allen Hills in Antarctica, some remote parts of the Australian outback, some desert terrains,and a few other places. But at ALL of these, finds are rare and usually found by experts or after a sighted fall. I personally am agnostic on if you block questions on meteorites. An alternative would be to have a good single reply put on by a moderator, with some general information where to find out more about meteorites and then lock the thread.

The chance that any amateur meteorite sleuth would find one is, as mentioned above, close to zero. The chance they would have six to present, all different, all found by them, IS ZERO....

The following from the IMCA "If you suspect that you have a meteorite, first do some preliminary "analysis." Does it have a dark, oftentimes "glassy" fusion crust as an outer covering? Meteorites develop this crust as material is ablated off during passage through the Earth's atmosphere. The presence of such a crust-like material strongly indicates a meteorite, while the absence of a crust strongly indicates a meteor"wrong." However, it should be noted that meteorites found in the "hot deserts" usually do not exhibit a dark fusion crust, due to terrestrial weathering.

Also, because of the iron content, the overwhelming majority of meteorites respond to a magnet (particularly if it is an iron meteorite!). If there is no pull when a magnet is placed against the suspected stone, it probably is not a meteorite. As well, a true meteorite will be much heavier than a similiar sized terrestrial rock.

Now, if the suspected stone passes the above tests, it might be a meteorite! IMCA does not have the facilities to test suspected meteorites but we would suggest that you contact one of the meteorite verification laboratories listed under Classifying Institutions.

Note: Send only a small (walnut size - if possible) sample(s). Testing may take a month to a year depending upon the backlog of the facility. "
Back to top
This topic is locked: you cannot edit posts or make replies. Reply with quote
Like
1
   

Jordi Fabre
Overall coordinator of the Forum



Joined: 07 Aug 2006
Posts: 4070
Location: Barcelona


Access to the FMF Gallery title=

View user's profile

Send private message

PostPosted: May 12, 2018 13:05    Post subject: Re: Meterorite or am I crazy  

kakov wrote:
...I think time has come to introduce the same rule as in Spanish FMF: Meteorites are taboo. That is: any „is this meteorite?” question should be simply deleted. (of course explaining this in advance in the rules of the forum)

In http://www.mineral-forum.com/message-board/viewtopic.php?p=61974#61974 Jordi Fabre wrote:
I totally agree with what Kushmeja says, and I just want to add that after many problems in the Spanish side of FMF about this kind of requests, we decided not to talk and stop talking about meteorites there, because whom proposed them tended to insist until to exasperation, basically because many times they just wanted someone to say that they could be right in order to use that answer to sell the rock and take money for it.
If this also happens here, we will not hesitate to avoid the "meteorite" topic altogether and block the posts that talk about them.

What we do in Spanish FMF is not to delete the messages (we do not like to delete anything) asking for "meteorites" but close them (publishing an explanatory message at the same time) to avoid repetitive questions, often without arguments, since many times these questions are more a wish than a minimally objective scientific reality.

Given the success that this initiative has had in Spanish FMF, from now on we will do the same here, starting with this same thread.
Back to top
This topic is locked: you cannot edit posts or make replies. Reply with quote
Like
1
   
Display posts from previous:   
   Index -> FOR BEGINNERS: What is it? Where is it from?   All times are GMT - 5 Hours
Page 1 of 1
    

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You can download files in this forum


All pictures, text, design © Forum FMF 2006-2018


Powered by FMF