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Etched morganite from Brazil
  
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appies




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PostPosted: Aug 29, 2013 05:46    Post subject: Etched morganite from Brazil  

Hello all,

I'm new on the forum. I have a question about a morganite crystal.

This is an item from Urucum mine, Galiléia, Doce valley, Minas Gerais, Brazil.

This piece has two sides who are straight and not etched. My question is or this is natural of pollised.

Could someone help me?

Thanks a lot.

Greetings Albert



DSCF9486.JPG
 Description:
Morganite
Urucum mine (Tim mine; Córrego do Urucum pegmatite), Galiléia, Doce valley, Minas Gerais, Brazilie
3.5x2.7x2 cm
 Viewed:  11571 Time(s)

DSCF9486.JPG


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Riccardo Modanesi




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PostPosted: Aug 29, 2013 07:40    Post subject: Re: Etched morganite from Brazil.  

Hi Apppies!
First of all it's sometimes difficult to detect whether a crystal is natural or polished/cut just from a photo (and this is the case), because some crystals are polished by following their natural shape. Then I think the major issue is whether a gemstone is natural or synthetic (synthetic beryls, including morganite, DO exist!!!), not whether a crystal is natural or polished. As an appearance, this crystal seems to me polished by following its natural shape. Maybe I'm wrong!
Greetings from Italy by Riccardo.

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Hi! I'm a collector of minerals since 1973 and a gemmologist. On Summer I always visit mines and quarries all over Europe looking for minerals! Ok, there is time to tell you much much more! Greetings from Italy by Riccardo.
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appies




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PostPosted: Aug 29, 2013 08:16    Post subject: Re: Etched morganite from Brazil.  

Hi riccardo.

Thanks for your reaction. Is it possible to findout whether this crystal is real or fake? I think its real because it came from a proper dealer.

Greetings albert
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bob kerr




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PostPosted: Aug 29, 2013 08:18    Post subject: Re: Etched morganite from Brazil.  

I believe these are natural. they've been on the market for sometime and I bought mine from carlos vasconselos who assured me that these are indeed natural, partially etched beryls.

here's two photos of mine - note that there is an overall hexagonal shape and also some only partially etched faces. these are quite interesting - although frankly calling these morganite is a bit of a stretch - goshenite is more appropriate.

also, the locality given to me by carlos was Rubelita Mine, Minas Gerais, Brazil.

bob



DSCN1515a.jpg
 Description:
beryl
Rubelita Mine, Minas Gerais, Brazil
note hexagonal form
 Viewed:  11547 Time(s)

DSCN1515a.jpg



DSCN1516.JPG
 Description:
beryl
Rubelita Mine, Minas Gerais, Brazil
7cm across
note smooth flat faces
 Viewed:  11470 Time(s)

DSCN1516.JPG


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appies




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PostPosted: Aug 29, 2013 08:44    Post subject: Re: Etched morganite from Brazil.  

I've got an other piece from this mine with all end etched. I can't imagine this pieces are fake because of the etching and origin. I can see the same "pollished" side on your crystal. Thanks for your information!


DSCF9505.JPG
 Description:
Morganite (beryl)
Urucum mine, Galiléia, Doce valley, Minas Gerais, Brazil
4x3.5x1.5 cm
 Viewed:  11495 Time(s)

DSCF9505.JPG


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John S. White
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PostPosted: Aug 29, 2013 09:40    Post subject: Re: Etched morganite from Brazil.  

It is not at all unusual for crystals, especially those from pegmatites and especially beryls, even though extensively etched, to have faces that appear to have been untouched. Almost always, however, such faces will have some natural irregularities on their surface, even if a loupe is required to see them. By that I mean that they will not be perfectly smooth featureless mirrorlike planes. I believe your crystal is completely natural.
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Riccardo Modanesi




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PostPosted: Aug 30, 2013 06:20    Post subject: Re: Etched morganite from Brazil.  

Hi to everybody!
According to what Appies wrote: yes it is possible! If you see the crystal in through-light by a microscope, you will see the inclusions! If it contains mineral inclusions, healed fractures etc., it is natural. Exception: phenakite inclusions in synthetic beryls. If it contains residuals of flux substances (dark), or growth inhomogeneities etc., it is synthetic. About the shape: normally it is clearly sightable whether the crystal faces are natural or polished! The natural (untreated) ones usually show growth structures, which are hidden by the politure operation.
Greetings from Italy by Riccardo.

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Hi! I'm a collector of minerals since 1973 and a gemmologist. On Summer I always visit mines and quarries all over Europe looking for minerals! Ok, there is time to tell you much much more! Greetings from Italy by Riccardo.
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PostPosted: Aug 30, 2013 07:37    Post subject: Re: Etched morganite from Brazil.  

Riccardo, we are not discussing whether the crystal is natural or synthetic, we are discussing the flat faces which probably are natural even though much of the crystal is etched. Appies probably should not have used the word fake when he was referring to the possibility that the faces have been polished and not natural. I am sure he did not intend to suggest that the crystal might be synthetic.
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Riccardo Modanesi




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PostPosted: Aug 31, 2013 04:20    Post subject: Re: Etched morganite from Brazil.  

John S. White wrote:
Riccardo, we are not discussing whether the crystal is natural or synthetic, we are discussing the flat faces which probably are natural even though much of the crystal is etched. Appies probably should not have used the word fake when he was referring to the possibility that the faces have been polished and not natural. I am sure he did not intend to suggest that the crystal might be synthetic.


Hi John! First of all I apologize for my misunderstanding, if confirmed by Appies. About the faces of the crystal I think I already gave my opinion: if growth linesor structures are sightable, it is natural for sure. If they are not sightable, it is probably polished. Growth structures are erased by the polishing operation. But I agree with you John: a polished crystal of a natural mineral is NOT a fake! Otherwise all of faceted gemstones would be!
Greetings from Italy by Riccardo.

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Hi! I'm a collector of minerals since 1973 and a gemmologist. On Summer I always visit mines and quarries all over Europe looking for minerals! Ok, there is time to tell you much much more! Greetings from Italy by Riccardo.
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herrej




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PostPosted: Sep 26, 2013 09:15    Post subject: Re: Etched morganite from Brazil  

Hello Albert,

The pieces look natural to me.

I have an similar one from Sao Geraldo do Baixio, Minas Gerais.

You can take both pieces with you when you visit me. We can look at the edges if they are natural.

Regards

Harry Zondervan



Goshenite 3.JPG
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appies




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PostPosted: Sep 26, 2013 16:06    Post subject: Re: Etched morganite from Brazil  

Harry,

Nice to see you on the forum. Will bring them with me next visit

Greetings albert
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cascaillou




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PostPosted: Oct 24, 2013 08:00    Post subject: Re: Etched morganite from Brazil  

under the the microscope, a natural crystal facet usually show growth features, irregularities, or small defects, while polishing will erase any of these producing a smooth surface. Polished facets are also often slightly curved with dull angles. You might also check for polishing marks (curved striae seen on the surface of facets under magnification in reflected light)

Sometimes you also see crystals (mostly quartz) which have been completely recut with wrong angles between the facets.

Let's also note that sometimes, the facets of carbonate minerals are acid treated to improve luster (I'm not familiar with this treatment, but maybe someone here will be able to tell you how this can be spotted under magnification).
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