FMF - Friends of Minerals Forum, discussion and message board

[James Catmur]

It looks like Westmorland and Cumberland may come back, as administrative districts within the county of Cumbria. So not the historical counties, but it could get a bit confusing on labels:

Westmorland and Furness, Cumbria
Cumberland, Cumbria

Seems to be a case of gerrymandering (according to some people)

James

[SteveB]

Possibly gerrymandering, but i encounter this in genealogy too where church parish boundaries change and are used for some type of records. As for my mineral collection i use a written journal to help catalog and label my finds (and research/test results involved with better identification of them. I try to use the most accurate GPS co-ordinates along with the location name at time of find. With GPS I would hope if my collection and records survive together and place names change in the future with political whim then the information can be updated as needed. Essentially I try to keep every data point for a specimen at the best possible precision.

Of course in this hobby many people keep locations as vague and secret to “keep” a fossicking location entirely to themselves. So greed causes the loss or distortion of location information already anyway. It's rare to buy a specimen that has accurate location information provided. Many crystals are just labelled as coming from “China”, nothing closer to a more precise location, of course this feeds the notion it's a manufactured specimen.

So does it really matter if locations are reinstated? We should just accurately record as best we can the exact find location at the time of a find and treat any location on something you buy or have given to you as a possibility not a certain fact. Unless you brought the specimen out of the ground with your own hands you can never be 100% certain anyway.

Steve

[Jesse Fisher]

Place names have long been subject to the vagaries of politics and changes in local culture, and obviously have no respect for the more timeless qualities of local geology. Any mineral collection that contains specimens of any age will be a good document of this, My fluorite from La Burg was once from Midi-Pyrénées and is now from Occitanie. My feldspar twin was once from Karlsbad but is now from Karlovy Vary. My microcline and fluorite was once from Silesia, but is now from Strzegom. My Pakistani beryl was once from the Northern Areas but is now from Balochistan. My Hilton fluorite was once from Westmorland, but is now from Cumbria. Maybe it will once again be from Westmorland. As collectors, all we can do is attempt to keep our labels updated as we become aware of these things. I wish that Mindat had a notification service I could sign up for that would send out automatic updates on changes to geographical and political divisions which effect the naming of mineral locations!

[James Catmur]

They are back, time to change all our labels (again)?

https://www.wikiwand.com/en/Cumberland_(unitary_authority)
https://www.wikiwand.com/en/Westmorland_and_Furness
(links normalized by FMF but first link takes you to the old county not the new unitary authority. You need to copy the whole link and not click on it)

[Roy Starkey]

Hi James
Yes, it is a bit of a pain but politicians will always fiddle with administrative boundaries. My personal view (and we are uniquely fortunate in the UK) is that so long as the label (and the specimen) has an Ordnance Survey National Grid Reference (preferably 8 figures, but 6 will suffice in most instances) the locality is adequately defined no matter what the surrounding parish, county or country is called!

I'll include a 'gratuitous' image of the Lake District looking magnificent on a lovely day in March 2023 - the shot is taken from Helvellyn looking towards St Sunday Crag. Enjoy!